Ms. Izzy,
Are we going to see some articles for the guys? Will there be a body of work that talks to them as directly as we have been able to talk to one another? Will they be supported to do the “right thing” in their second family, and even to find out what that will be?
I dream that men will get some practical, detailed support for ways to handle their situations. It’s almost like they need a re-marriage manual. 1) Make sure you have tightened boundaries with your ex. This looks like X, Y, Z. 2) Make sure everyone has a place to sleep, eat, and hide. 3) Post the new house rules. Do not leave this up to osmosis. And so on.
I have also really begun pondering the term, “permissive” dad. Is that really true? In our case, and I’m sure we’re not alone, it’s more accurate to say “fearful” dad. He’s been conditioned slowly, gradually, over the years to think that if he doesn’t go along with ex/kids that he loses their love. Nothing I say has convinced him that he IS the father and that it won’t matter, they will always love him. We don’t have issues with Severe PAS, more like constant low-level bashing, but it’s enough to make the situation completely distasteful for him and it’s a sign of his commitment to peace that he really doesn’t want to stir the pot. So, is that permissive or is that managing?
Maybe we should say, the manipulated parent. Lots and lots to think about.
Dear Kim,
You bring up a very important point and one that hits me right between the eyes. In my memoir The Package Deal, I write about the fearful father:
I felt like Hank automatically defended his former wife when he should be sticking up for his current one. Hank felt like I pushed him into battle with her.
“I have to be careful,” he said.
“Hank, you’re not going to lose your kids just because you say something she doesn’t want to hear.”
My husband can’t imagine anything worse than losing his boys, literally or figuratively, and the surest way to keep this from happening (he’s convinced himself) is to keep his ex-wife happy. Happy is subjective, but in our case, happiness is synonymous with placating her. Don’t provoke, offend or contradict. Let her think she’s in control. Who’s manipulating who?
I re-posted Kela Price’s Happy Marriage or Happy Divorce because I agree that our men are often stuck in the uncomfortable middle with no remarriage manual on how to break free, how to fearlessly love his kids and maintain a level of civility.
Stepmother’s Milk readers: any of you have any advice or expertise on this subject?
Tags: divorced_men, remarriage
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I soooo relate to the fearful father!!! I have (had) one in my house!!!!
Very interesting. I am recently married to a divorced dad, and we are going through this right now. It’s not so much that my husband wants to placate his ex, but that he wants to placate EVERYONE. His guilt informs every decision he makes, which is a recipe for disaster. I must, he does a really good job for the most part. I have to remind myself that none of us came equipped with a manual for this. But he is in what he feels a precarious position as a pivot for his first family and his new.
My main issue to date has been having to advocate for my position in the family and the home. I came with a daughter into the marriage, but she doesn’t know her father. So at least that’s one less player! And he and his ex have a pretty good co parenting relationship. It’s just his guilt allows him to cater to his son’s and ex’s demands very quickly without input from me. He just recently took seriously a suggestion from his son and ex that we “all” spend an evening together playing games. I had to remind him that, although he and his ex may have moved beyond the point where this would be uncomfortable, that I still have not developed territory, so to speak, in my home or family, and that I am still quite living in the shadow of his former marriage.
So I guess my advice to men would be, it will be a very hard juggling act – don’t think it won’t be. But you don’t have to do it alone. Just treat your second wife as a co-head of the family (which includes your children) and allow her to have her own personal boundaries. Chances are, she wants the peace and harmony that you do and will help achieve that goal. As long as she feels like an important player in the game. And remember that children grow up, but your current wife will be the one who accompanies you through the rest of your life (hopefully).
Hi Izzy,
I’m going to ask my husband a few questions, but there’s one thing he does not do – placate his ex-wife. He is, by personality, one of the most easy going, laid back kinda guys you’ll ever meet. He’s got a good nature and that spills over to everyone (it’s one of the things I LOVE about him) – that said, he was pushed around for 17 years, and after their divorce, he pretty much put a stop to it. Once I came into the picture, their relationship found an even keel. He does and will say NO to her. She’s a reasonable person and does not go off the deep end – often we can work things out as a team.
Now…what does he say…right…”I will not cater to someone else’s dysfunctionality.” (Smart man, that husband of mine!)
Yeah, I completely agree with everyone. AND, I think they need their own Package Deal book and Remarried DAD reading list. For all the reasons you listed, Ms Izzy . . . because they are afraid and they need some support and because they are vulnerable to being manipulated, by everyone.
Maybe there are resources already out there, I’ve know I’ve read a lot of books written for the stepmother, hoping to find my perspective on what has felt like “madness” at times. My life sounds similar to Kazure (minus the child she brought) and my heart aches for my husband. He has a tough job and could use some guidance. I pass on some of the info I get from the books but it’s not the same for him. I think he’s looking for a “guy list” which might be like a recipe of ideas and a list of the top 10 things he should do. He’s a man of action, just talking about it isn’t going to fit for him.
And, he’s learning slowly, but he’s getting it and I love him for trying. I just wish he had as much support as I do and then I wonder if men can’t get their support this way. Maybe there’s a different way.
I would love to hear some other resources if anyone knows of them.
Men definitely need more resources. I am dating a fairly recently divorced dad of 3 children under the age of 5. His ex definitely has some manipulation tactics in use and he is like many of the dads you all have mentioned… completely in love with and dedicated to his children. He often gives in to his ex and does whatever he can to keep the peace because he feels like she can keep him from seeing his kids. He is slowly finding his own feet in all of this but could definitely use some more resources.
I think the last commenter hit it on the head… men aren’t like us women… reading a good book or a blog probably wont give them the same support it gives us. The best book I found for him was “Wednesday Evenings And Every Other Weekend: From Divorced Dad To Competent Co-Parent”.. it is a very good book written by a man for men… my man just doesn’t happen to be much of a reader. We read some of it together and I do think it gave him some new perspectives on things. The one issue I have with the book is that in some ways it does suggest to the man to simply give in much of the time, or at least that is how it seemed…. but its worth a shot.
I married a man with 4 kids 24 years ago. We had custody of the 2 girls and she had the 2 boys. She eventually got the girls b/c it’s only natural that girls would want to be with their mom. We all lived about 1500 miles apart. My husband dutifully paid in full all child support that was required of him. Then the ex decides to tell EVERYONE that the last child had a different dad after all! He did his level best through-out the years to be there for them and not anger the ex. It never did any good, she always swore at him and hated me so much that I was the BIG “C***” – he never defended me because he didn’t want to anger her more than she already was. I never stuck my nose in all that insane business between my husband and his ex because he & I agreed that was best. The ex and her kids all have lived 1500 miles away so we are not close. But throughout the years we honestly wanted to be close to the kids. My husband and I have always sent bday cards with money, we sent care packages, we sent holiday cards with money, we sent plane tickets for the kids to come visit us, NOT ONE thank you UNLESS my husband called them!! And NOT ONE child was allowed from their mom to come & visit us. She couldn’t get herself to teach them to be grateful. She did teach them to hate me, but unfortunately, their hate for me has overtaken any relationship that they could have had with their dad and he is a wonderful man.
When we had custody of his daughters, I took them to Catholic Church every Sunday and got them as far as 1st Communion until they went with their mother. They haven’t went to church since they left us because the ex couldn’t get herself to teach them religion.
After all these years and all her hatred, the ex gets a case of nostalgia and texts my husband with “still think of you” and “still love you after all these years” texts. He didn’t respond because he was so grossed out, but I responded. I played on the texting for awhile but I thought she was drunk so I told her to quit being foolish and go to bed. Then she told all the kids that I interfered with her & their dad and kept them apart. Now they are back in her hate-filled court again and they aren’t keeping in touch again. But, my husband and I know that she kicked my husband out of their family circle a long time ago. We also learned another hard lesson. She tricked him into marrying her when she was 16 & pregnant and she has lied to him every step of the way since. She was to get child support until each child was 19 & 1/2 years old, that’s almost 20 years old! But ALL 4 KIDS QUIT High School when they were 16 or 17 so she lied about the child support. So, she has lied to my husband ever since he was 16
We never had a book, all my husband and I had was each other. You’re blessed if you have a good ex to work with, a good person to deal with, someone fair and who thinks more of their children more than their hatred.